"I worked with our topic all week and couldn't come up with much. Our notes from 2000 ([#topic=20000608#]) helped, but I was looking for fresh insights and demonstrations."

"It's hard to say what success is. Everyone has an opinion and book shelves sag under the weight of books about it. But isn't success a personal thing — what I'm satisfied with?"

"I agree I have to be satisfied, but there's some necessary reference to what others think, how I'm being received."

"Freud wanted to help people achieve happiness or success in work and love. If I'm happy in those areas, then I'm a success."

"Well even after years of therapy I'm still driven by motives like vanity and — what should I call it? — a kind of paranoia of being watched by others. I'm always trying to look good for others. That applies to my practice of Christian Science too. I need to have health, happiness and harmony, not just because they're the reality of being but because they look good to others."

"I can see a lot of that in myself, but I've been able to find my real self in the morass. In my case, the obsession with what others think came from childhood neglect. The appropriate, 'Look Mommy what I'm doing,' was unmet by maternal care, and could not be released naturally, so it got dragged into adulthood and intruded all over the place: with bosses, lovers, even strangers in my daily rounds. Once I got unto the game and caught myself getting inappropriately needy, I could let go, with something like, 'Why, hello mother,' or 'Hey, Mom (God), please pay attention.'"

"I've handled my abandonment issue by deep concentrated work, in a friendly atmosphere. When I write my stories, I like to do it in a coffee shop, with friendly noises in the background. People sometimes walk over and ask why I'm staring into space and a conversation opens up. The whole experience can be one of accomplishment and a connection to people."

"There you are Dr. Freud — work and love! When you talk about it you glow and it seems to me you're free of parental imagos giving the orders."

"What are parental imagos?"

"They're internalized images of our earth parents we carry around in the unconscious. If we don't get over them and let our own selfhood emerge, we'll live an inauthentic life. We may be successful to outer appearances but it'll all be an offering at the feet of these false gods."

"How do we know whether we're living the real thing?"

"I can't say for others, but for me imago drives feel like I'm getting into something uninteresting and enervating. It can aim towards mania. Over time we can get to know what's real in us and what's not."

"Was Jesus a success?"

"In line with what we're saying — yes, definitely! We don't know how he did with teenage dating or carpentry, but when his story clicks in we get lots of information about his healing and teaching work and his love — both agape and more subtly, erotic. We see him tell his mother to buzz off..."

"And take that maternal imago with you!"

"Yes. And we have his crowning achievement — working out his at-one-ment with God through the crucifixion, resurrection and ascension. He had a huge success."

"When he finished, there was nothing more to do!"

"At least on this plane. He may have graduated to other challenges and lessons on some higher level."

"I was thinking about what models I had for success as I was growing up. When I was a teenager we were all supposed to be good looking, play football, be rich, date debutantes, drink a lot and have no academic or artistic talents."

"Looks like you made the grade!"

"Thanks. Of course I didn't — not even close, so I was miserable. It took years to get over it. Living in New York and studying Christian Science helped."

"Can anyone define success in his own words?"

"I'll try. It's living in accord with your best understanding of infinite good, no matter what the senses are saying."

"That's really important, not to get discouraged by appearances but to keep focusing on the presence of infinite perfection. That's what's going on and that's what's coming through."

"Did you all have role models, growing up?"

"Sure. Lou Costello, Jackie Gleason, Art Carney and Lucille Ball. I love their comedy work but I've also read books about them. They were all really fine humans. Oh, I also looked up to Einstein and Stephen Hawking."

"I took Mary Baker Eddy as a role model very early. I've always been able to read her words as though she was right there speaking them. I also loved the old movie stars like Basil Rathbone and Errol Flynn. I was drawn to Judy Garland and Talulah Bankhead, but as I found out about the mess they made of their lives, I guess I was attracted to their public image."

"That public image thing — today the media are intent on knocking it down and getting a real look. I suppose it's better than the old notion of keeping everything under wraps."

"Up to a point. But while America obsesses about Michael Jackson's pajamas or Baretta's not guilty verdict, some really important stuff gets through, under the radar. Like no minimum wage rise and drilling in Anwar."

"Or how about the bizarre appointments of John Bolton to the UN and Paul Wolfowitz to the World Bank? Are these in-your-face to the hilt or am I missing something?"

"They're pretty in-your-face, but what's the old line? They'll have Bush's confidence and speak with his authority."

"I heard one kindly UN official say Bolton can speak to Congress in their language."

"I missed what the Daily Show did with these two. It must have been rare; I mean it's made for comedy."

"I went to a seminar on sandplay recently. The point was made there that when you're struggling to recover from trauma, the logically oriented left brain freezes up. You can't access its strategies to help you get out of the trauma. But the illogical, playful right brain can help. Maybe all the trash news stories and comedic doings in Washington are assisting us to recover from 9/11 and five years of Republican government."

"I hope we can abort this inhuman pregnancy."

"Let's see if we can put some metaphysics on these bones."

"Okay. Let's start with this from Science and Health: '...the crude forms of human thought take on higher symbols and significations, when scientifically Christian views of the universe appear, illuminating time with the glory of eternity.' (pg. 502:17)"

"How would you see right brain/left brain through the lens of Science?"

"Well, there's certainly Science there, since 'Every material belief hints the existence of spiritual reality;...' (Miscellaneous Writings, pg. 60)"

"If I could jump in — yesterday at church the readings brought out the healing of sin through reading divine Mind, not mortal mind. Our tendency as mortals is to come down hard on sin from a mortal standpoint. And of course then we're caught in the same vortex of evil and there's no healing. If we're really interested in healing the trauma of 9/11 and Republicanism, let's read divine Mind."

"Do you have some quotes for us?"

"Here we go. They're from Science and Health: 'There is mortal mind-reading and immortal Mind-reading. The latter is a revelation of divine purpose through spiritual understanding, by which man gains the divine Principle and explanation of all things. Mortal mind-reading and immortal Mind-reading are distinctly opposite standpoints, from which cause and effect are interpreted. The act of reading mortal mind investigates and touches only human beliefs. Science is immortal and coordinate neither with the premises nor with the conclusions of mortal beliefs.' (pg. 83:25) And of course: 'Jesus beheld in Science the perfect man, who appeared to him where sinning mortal man appears to mortals.' (pg. 476:32)"

"So what's going on when people are talking about right brain/left brain may be something much deeper. The immense truth of divine Mind unfolding its harmony is coming to the surface. As students of Christian Science we can't afford to laze around in dualistic concepts."

"I've been looking at Wayne Dyer on PBS during their fund raising. He's saying what Mrs. Eddy said but giving her no credit."

"Do you suppose Christian Science will survive and succeed with the Wayne Dyers, Courses in Miracles and so on while the church asphyxiates itself with meaningless rules?"

"That's a sad thought but Christian Science should be able to survive through individual study and practice, perhaps with groups like this one."

"We're getting close to the end of the meeting. Is there anything else?"

"I'd like to mention steroid use in sports. Isn't it just the natural consequence of our emphasis on winning at all costs?"

"That's success in America. But this whole story and the congressional hearings — it's all another trash story to divert attention from the important issues."

"Definitely, but it lifts the veil on our national character and should shock us back to our senses."

"But it probably won't. It's too convenient to point fingers at bloated baseball players and leave it there. Meanwhile American triumphalism rolls on."

"I know time is short, but I have to describe something I heard on NPR this morning. Women dating or married to Black men are terrified their men are on the downlow, having sex with men and possibly transmitting HIV to them. Such is the homophobia in the Black community that they wouldn't dare ask their men to put on a condom — the implication being they're Gay. So they run around checking medicine cabinets for face creams and stuff like that to make sure the men are sticking to a stereotypical street thug macho image, which they think insures no HIV. Of course it's absurd since the whole point of downlow is to be as street-thuggy as possible."

"I'm sure there are plenty of white men not being asked to slip on a condom for the same reasons."

"Yes, but whites are getting a bit more comfortable with metrosexualism."

"You just need some Black dudes for the prudes on TV extolling the glories of looking and smelling your best."

"Now we must close. I don't think we got to the spiritual bottom of that last issue, but maybe next week's topic can speak to it."

"How about Spiritual Being?"

"Sounds good to me."

"Okay?"

"Fine."

"Good."

"Bam! We got it in one try — Spiritual Being."